I said early that "A Study in Scarlet" was one of the few novels where there wasn't enough information for the readers to figure out the villains and ect. ahead of time... I feel a little along the same lines with the Italian Secretary - but that might have been my lack of understanding of the plot and etc.... I felt it just jumped from one thing to another....
But... I wonder now why Doyle changed everything. We'll... In a Study in Scarlet, by leaving us all out of the picture including especially the police... we are further amazed by his deducing abiltiy.. Not only is he able to provide a name and a motivation and unfoil everything, he captures the actual person. Pretty amazing if you ask me.. while everyone else is still confused about this part of the investigation or get a false lead and false person... Holmes has it all figured out in his head and is already in the process of capturing the person... and well ahead of the police even starting to follow thier false lead...
So that's, like what I said earlier... the reason for him leaving us out of the loop always... Not to the extreme of his first short story though -since that probably would have gotten annoying.... For the reader to not knwo enough or even know the name of the villain adn then have him captured.
Just a thought.
Sunday, November 25, 2007
Next Book.... The Italian Secretary.
This book, by Celeb Carr, is essentially a "Sherlock Holmes" Tale. Holmes and Watson are the main characters, and it takes place in the same time period... So... it's like an original Sherlock HOlmes story - he even attempts to mimic the similar style and etc...Apparently... only a few of the words used by Watson (who narrates the story) is changed "in teh interest of accommodating modern readers, the anachronistic spelling soof several words" have been updated.
But... This book like the rest of Holmes' stories start in his apartment... with a note to start it off.
In the beginning his brother sends an encrypted message ... along the lines of "Youse done a special one, at No. 8 Pall mall - 'The sun burns too thoot, the sky fills with familar eagles' - read mcKay and Sinclair, collected works...Have your palm read for protection.... my old crofter will pull alongside at Quarantine" - It makes almost no sense at all... But Holmes understands it immediately... and lets Watson figure it out on his own - with some help of course... but still Watson has to use his own reasoning skills - I'm guessing to partially explain it to the reader that don't understand... not only because it is encrypted but becuase we are out of context in understanding it, too.
---There seems to be a lot of that in these stories.. Holmes understanding and knowing more... like him understanding "scotish nationalists" who attack HOlmes and Watson on their way to the castle are simply "better than averaage impostors" and not actual scottish nationalists - which we find out at the end of the book that they are imposters.
He understands more and can deduce more but we, even the more intelligent of us are left out of the loop. If not because Holmes is more logical and deducing capable person, it is because we are not at the scene of the crime and cannot figure it out for ourselves, -since everythign is filtered through Watson.
----but as to why Doyle does that and Carr mimics it? It's evident in a lot of HOlmes stories and even in other detective/thrillers that follow it. What do you think?
My reasoning is partially... that it's like a teaser.... keeps us interested but out of teh loop for a more dramatic ending? And we accept it becuase why? We'll we accept he's right and is proably correct in his assumptions because well as Watson himself says... He's right so often that its almost impossible to think of him as being wrong.
Also, it might be part of what builds his character.... Confidence in what he knows is correct but he's only willing to give out so much information about it.
So.... there's some food for thought.
Next order of business....
I found a piece of evidence for the police thing. ... ok not exactly following it... but it does provide some historical background to the entire thing.
"This is nether a matter for the local authorities nor one for Scotland Yard," Replied Mycroft. You yourself know how unsafe truly sensitive information can be, in their hands." ---This shows thies lack of faith in the ability and value of the police force - As does the reference to the police in "A Study in Scarlet" and in books like the Alienist. And... also the Dante Club... - Everyones a bit unforgiving on them!... Anyways...
That's it for now....
Probably More on the Italian secretary later.
But... This book like the rest of Holmes' stories start in his apartment... with a note to start it off.
In the beginning his brother sends an encrypted message ... along the lines of "Youse done a special one, at No. 8 Pall mall - 'The sun burns too thoot, the sky fills with familar eagles' - read mcKay and Sinclair, collected works...Have your palm read for protection.... my old crofter will pull alongside at Quarantine" - It makes almost no sense at all... But Holmes understands it immediately... and lets Watson figure it out on his own - with some help of course... but still Watson has to use his own reasoning skills - I'm guessing to partially explain it to the reader that don't understand... not only because it is encrypted but becuase we are out of context in understanding it, too.
---There seems to be a lot of that in these stories.. Holmes understanding and knowing more... like him understanding "scotish nationalists" who attack HOlmes and Watson on their way to the castle are simply "better than averaage impostors" and not actual scottish nationalists - which we find out at the end of the book that they are imposters.
He understands more and can deduce more but we, even the more intelligent of us are left out of the loop. If not because Holmes is more logical and deducing capable person, it is because we are not at the scene of the crime and cannot figure it out for ourselves, -since everythign is filtered through Watson.
----but as to why Doyle does that and Carr mimics it? It's evident in a lot of HOlmes stories and even in other detective/thrillers that follow it. What do you think?
My reasoning is partially... that it's like a teaser.... keeps us interested but out of teh loop for a more dramatic ending? And we accept it becuase why? We'll we accept he's right and is proably correct in his assumptions because well as Watson himself says... He's right so often that its almost impossible to think of him as being wrong.
Also, it might be part of what builds his character.... Confidence in what he knows is correct but he's only willing to give out so much information about it.
So.... there's some food for thought.
Next order of business....
I found a piece of evidence for the police thing. ... ok not exactly following it... but it does provide some historical background to the entire thing.
"This is nether a matter for the local authorities nor one for Scotland Yard," Replied Mycroft. You yourself know how unsafe truly sensitive information can be, in their hands." ---This shows thies lack of faith in the ability and value of the police force - As does the reference to the police in "A Study in Scarlet" and in books like the Alienist. And... also the Dante Club... - Everyones a bit unforgiving on them!... Anyways...
That's it for now....
Probably More on the Italian secretary later.
Friday, November 23, 2007
A study in Scarlet
So... back to it again.
While I was looking up Sherlock Holmes... I found out that a study in scarlet was different from all the other sherlock holmes/detective stories because you weren't actually able to figure out who the villain was at all... The name Jefferson Hope(I think that was it) isn't revealed to you until Sherlock figures it out.
(I didn't notice this myself because, normally, I don't figure out who the villain is/what happened until the end... kind of like Watson .... but even more clueless) The only one I can figure it out for are the Dan Brown novels... cuz the plot gets a little predictable.. but anyways....
I'm not sure if I said this earlier.. but I think part of the allure of Holmes is his intelligence and capabilities.
But, besides the character himself, which is very important on its own.... there is also the reoccuring idea of the sidekick character, the impossible/creative plot, the danger, and maybe police involvement too? In every mystery novel I've read (casi todos...) there's always a reference to the Harvard Yard, or the FBI blah blah... you get the picture.... Though, that probably has more to do with it being a crime and crimes needing crminal prosecutors... But in a lot of books including the Alienest, the Dante Club, and the Sherlock Holmes novles, the police (some of them) are helpful to the protagonists.... while others... are not so friendly. ---But truthfully I don't think they are as important... but yet again maybe they are... you tell me.
What I think the police element brings in is... 1.when they have a collaborator, they are on the same side as the "good people" and not the villains/and don't act as as a conspirator. But, at the same time, when they are against the rest of the "ignorant" - whether of racial acceptance or new sciences - we're ok with the protagonists making fun of them/working against them becuase we know they (the bad police people) are in the wrong... So., wrong against wrong is ok... not really but you get the picture.
According to the book I was reading, in teh picture, watson looked like/was portrayed as a dog..... meanign he possessed those characterisitcs. Loyalty, slight intelligence, obedience.... stuff like that... -and in other books.... sidekick characters have similarish characteristics. I wonder whether this has a reason on its own (the reason why Doyle used Watson) or because later people wanted to mimick Doyle's use of Watson to recreate teh success of the Holmes detective stories..
Anyways... All detective stories seem to have creative/intelligent plots. -But that makes sense, since if they are all similar/based on the same crime-it would get boring fast. And, it's good for Sherlock HOlmes, becuase he said quirks/strange things/out of place things make things easier. - cuz it's more specific and such... (makes sense to some degree. but that's only if you can make a good enough guess at figuring it out... so not so much sense is made i guess).
But ... also, I feel Holmes and his fellow successors make too many assumptions when making their guesses ( I'll find esamples later...)
Ok... that's it for now...
But just to sum a study in scarlet (I knwo i was more general in this post....but) it was the first one. Watson is set up as a sidekick... There was a crazy plot... not really understandable... We're still left out of the picture (but along with Watson too - probably another purpose of having him there. He's intelligent and learned, but even he who also witnesses the same thigns as HOlme can't figure it out... so we don't feel like idiots for not knowing ourselves.s
La dee da...
If anyone would like to answer my questions... It'd be GREATLY appreciated.
While I was looking up Sherlock Holmes... I found out that a study in scarlet was different from all the other sherlock holmes/detective stories because you weren't actually able to figure out who the villain was at all... The name Jefferson Hope(I think that was it) isn't revealed to you until Sherlock figures it out.
(I didn't notice this myself because, normally, I don't figure out who the villain is/what happened until the end... kind of like Watson .... but even more clueless) The only one I can figure it out for are the Dan Brown novels... cuz the plot gets a little predictable.. but anyways....
I'm not sure if I said this earlier.. but I think part of the allure of Holmes is his intelligence and capabilities.
But, besides the character himself, which is very important on its own.... there is also the reoccuring idea of the sidekick character, the impossible/creative plot, the danger, and maybe police involvement too? In every mystery novel I've read (casi todos...) there's always a reference to the Harvard Yard, or the FBI blah blah... you get the picture.... Though, that probably has more to do with it being a crime and crimes needing crminal prosecutors... But in a lot of books including the Alienest, the Dante Club, and the Sherlock Holmes novles, the police (some of them) are helpful to the protagonists.... while others... are not so friendly. ---But truthfully I don't think they are as important... but yet again maybe they are... you tell me.
What I think the police element brings in is... 1.when they have a collaborator, they are on the same side as the "good people" and not the villains/and don't act as as a conspirator. But, at the same time, when they are against the rest of the "ignorant" - whether of racial acceptance or new sciences - we're ok with the protagonists making fun of them/working against them becuase we know they (the bad police people) are in the wrong... So., wrong against wrong is ok... not really but you get the picture.
According to the book I was reading, in teh picture, watson looked like/was portrayed as a dog..... meanign he possessed those characterisitcs. Loyalty, slight intelligence, obedience.... stuff like that... -and in other books.... sidekick characters have similarish characteristics. I wonder whether this has a reason on its own (the reason why Doyle used Watson) or because later people wanted to mimick Doyle's use of Watson to recreate teh success of the Holmes detective stories..
Anyways... All detective stories seem to have creative/intelligent plots. -But that makes sense, since if they are all similar/based on the same crime-it would get boring fast. And, it's good for Sherlock HOlmes, becuase he said quirks/strange things/out of place things make things easier. - cuz it's more specific and such... (makes sense to some degree. but that's only if you can make a good enough guess at figuring it out... so not so much sense is made i guess).
But ... also, I feel Holmes and his fellow successors make too many assumptions when making their guesses ( I'll find esamples later...)
Ok... that's it for now...
But just to sum a study in scarlet (I knwo i was more general in this post....but) it was the first one. Watson is set up as a sidekick... There was a crazy plot... not really understandable... We're still left out of the picture (but along with Watson too - probably another purpose of having him there. He's intelligent and learned, but even he who also witnesses the same thigns as HOlme can't figure it out... so we don't feel like idiots for not knowing ourselves.s
La dee da...
If anyone would like to answer my questions... It'd be GREATLY appreciated.
Wednesday, November 7, 2007
A Study in Scarlet
I know a lot of other people have already read this one/will read this one....
But just in case, it is the first short story written by Doyle that has Sherlock Holmes as a character.
So.... what can I say about it. Well, I wouldn't say its typical... ok maybe I will.
Here's the gist of it... Big, Strange and Twisted murder happens. Nobody understands it... really confusing. Not the police, nada.
Then Sherlock does his investigation... seemingly random and crazy.
Then He does crazy stuff and explains some, only some and not all of what he knows... So we see what others (like the police) have missed out on ... but we still don't understand it completely.... kinda like a tease i guess.
Then voila, the person is captured. And were still confused.... Then big explaination/reasoning and we're all like... Woah... so obvious!!! why did i think of that?
The hero always stays the same and with the same qualities, and he always, except for once, wins... so how can we possibly love these stories, time after time. Generation after generation??!!
Let's analyze the character of Sherlock Holmes himself, first... If you guys know anything else about him that I don't (which is a lot) feel free to tell me.
He's a student/adult though, and understands a lot about Chemistry, reaonsing, logic and etc. /analysis
Highly intelligent, but slightly conceited at the same time....-not conceited as arrongant though... just extremely confident in his ability, and occasionally the lack of it in others. It must be the fact that he always gets it right... he's never been wrong yet... - but is that really possible?!!! for a real person... yet again he isn't real.
Anyways, his observation/logic skills, which most will connect ot his intelligence, is much higher than ours. Truthfully though, how many people can guess like he did that Dr. Watson had just come from a war. Here's what he said "i knew you came from Afganistan (where the war was) [because] here is a gentleman of a medical type, but with the air of a military man. clearly an army doctor, then. He has just come from teh tropics, for his face is dark, and that is not the natural tint of his skin, for his wrists are fair. He has undergone hardship and sickness, as his haggard face says clearly. His left arm has been injured. He holds it in a stiff an dunnatural manner. Hwere in the tropics could an English army doctor have seen much hardship and got his arm wounded? Clearly in afghanistan.' the whole train of thought did not occupy a second."
Rediciolous right? How could he figure ALL that out, and so soon? Oh the reasoning skills involved. Yet, as soon as i read that.... i was like... hmm... well his dad could have been in the military, maybe that's why... or how do you know he was of the "medical type"? Or... maybe he just went for a vacation... or what if he wasn't affected too much by the war.....-I know, weak questions but still... there is a possibility for error, yet not once (or maybe there has been a few, but for the majority not often) is there an error in his judgement.
---Is this what attracts us? The fact that he is almost perfect in the areas of his expertise?!!!!!
What do you guys think? Opinions would be GREATLY appreciated.
I'll talk a bit more 'bout Scarlet letter next time i think..... it was interesting and actually, though i said pretty typical.... there was one part that was confusing/different.
--Winnie
But just in case, it is the first short story written by Doyle that has Sherlock Holmes as a character.
So.... what can I say about it. Well, I wouldn't say its typical... ok maybe I will.
Here's the gist of it... Big, Strange and Twisted murder happens. Nobody understands it... really confusing. Not the police, nada.
Then Sherlock does his investigation... seemingly random and crazy.
Then He does crazy stuff and explains some, only some and not all of what he knows... So we see what others (like the police) have missed out on ... but we still don't understand it completely.... kinda like a tease i guess.
Then voila, the person is captured. And were still confused.... Then big explaination/reasoning and we're all like... Woah... so obvious!!! why did i think of that?
The hero always stays the same and with the same qualities, and he always, except for once, wins... so how can we possibly love these stories, time after time. Generation after generation??!!
Let's analyze the character of Sherlock Holmes himself, first... If you guys know anything else about him that I don't (which is a lot) feel free to tell me.
He's a student/adult though, and understands a lot about Chemistry, reaonsing, logic and etc. /analysis
Highly intelligent, but slightly conceited at the same time....-not conceited as arrongant though... just extremely confident in his ability, and occasionally the lack of it in others. It must be the fact that he always gets it right... he's never been wrong yet... - but is that really possible?!!! for a real person... yet again he isn't real.
Anyways, his observation/logic skills, which most will connect ot his intelligence, is much higher than ours. Truthfully though, how many people can guess like he did that Dr. Watson had just come from a war. Here's what he said "i knew you came from Afganistan (where the war was) [because] here is a gentleman of a medical type, but with the air of a military man. clearly an army doctor, then. He has just come from teh tropics, for his face is dark, and that is not the natural tint of his skin, for his wrists are fair. He has undergone hardship and sickness, as his haggard face says clearly. His left arm has been injured. He holds it in a stiff an dunnatural manner. Hwere in the tropics could an English army doctor have seen much hardship and got his arm wounded? Clearly in afghanistan.' the whole train of thought did not occupy a second."
Rediciolous right? How could he figure ALL that out, and so soon? Oh the reasoning skills involved. Yet, as soon as i read that.... i was like... hmm... well his dad could have been in the military, maybe that's why... or how do you know he was of the "medical type"? Or... maybe he just went for a vacation... or what if he wasn't affected too much by the war.....-I know, weak questions but still... there is a possibility for error, yet not once (or maybe there has been a few, but for the majority not often) is there an error in his judgement.
---Is this what attracts us? The fact that he is almost perfect in the areas of his expertise?!!!!!
What do you guys think? Opinions would be GREATLY appreciated.
I'll talk a bit more 'bout Scarlet letter next time i think..... it was interesting and actually, though i said pretty typical.... there was one part that was confusing/different.
--Winnie
Sunday, November 4, 2007
Ok...reworking...
I decided that I should probably read some of the Sherlock Holmes stories first, which i don't know too much of, before starting to compare the two....
So.. I decided to start with A Study in Scarlet, the first story by Doyle to feature Sherlock Holmes....
So far, it's like an introductory chapter, where you meet the characters - since this is the first time ever Holmes has been cited, there's a physical description ontop of the amazing detective skills and ect.
He has a tad bit of conceit about him, too...
Anyways... I'll read a little more before I blog again...
Maybe I'll do a little more Dante blogging, too - I read it straight-through because it was interesting.... and didn't really look for the elements I needed.... whoops...
Toodles!
Winnie
So.. I decided to start with A Study in Scarlet, the first story by Doyle to feature Sherlock Holmes....
So far, it's like an introductory chapter, where you meet the characters - since this is the first time ever Holmes has been cited, there's a physical description ontop of the amazing detective skills and ect.
He has a tad bit of conceit about him, too...
Anyways... I'll read a little more before I blog again...
Maybe I'll do a little more Dante blogging, too - I read it straight-through because it was interesting.... and didn't really look for the elements I needed.... whoops...
Toodles!
Winnie
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